I expect I will stay with it for some things, such as archiving selected articles.
Also, while took much of the year to happen, I have developed muscle memory for doing things in DT.
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For me, DEVONthink is my big archive blob of documents. I scan, OCR and move stuff into folders/groups and then into databases (Private, Company, Archive, Notes)
I guess the most value I get out of DT is it’s search and sync. Because everything is OCRed and indexed, I can very quickly find related documents or automatically move things like my monthly water bill into the correct folder.
Then even more important is the sync. Because I can setup multiple sync stores and they’are all independently encrypted, I have peace of mind that my data won’t get snooped and has multiple backup locations. And I can do things like say: On my phone I don’t need my Work database and so on.
I could probably replicate the OCR with just Abbyy and automation and SmartRules with Hazel. But the encrypted sync, organization and searching/classification I would have no idea how to do without DT.
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I don’t disagree that groups and folders are the same. The issue is that working with that many files in finder is much harder to do. The built in editing in DT makes if faster. The ease with which I can share the data across both of my macs and both iOS devices is a whole lot easier. I don’t have to worry or think about it I can just share the data easily and all in my own cloud system on my own WEBDav server. Trying to do that outside of DT is painful at best to nearly impossible.
edited for typos (Note to self, don’t answer forum posts late in the evening)
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For me, it’s all about classification. In my work (law), the PDFs pile up in no time. And Devonthink is the best thing I have found for organizing these in their project groups (along with project related emails, etc). Without at least this basic level of organization, I find myself spending a half hour or more searching for a single document I need—huge time waster for me. If I need more organization beyond the top project group level, I use tags. I limit groups to the top level only, as I find that limiting Devonthink’s classification options to the top level means that 7 out of 10 times, classification picks the right group automatically and all I have to do is hit ctrl+c and move on to the next (DT does have a script to exclude sub-groups from classification that I occasionally use). But if you are more of a “hunter gatherer” who prefers to search for what you need when you need it, I think Devonthink is not nearly as useful for this type of person.
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This sounds a little baby-bath water. A double-click in DT and you’re in Word or PowerPoint, etc. editing away. Note that this is the same as Finder - you can’t edit Word documents in Finder, but must open Word.
With DT being such an integral part of your workflow, does opening docs in Word from Finder rather than DT justify jettisoning the hub of your workflow?
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I concur. The whole point of DT is not to replace the apps, but work in conjunction with them: bring the best of both worlds - the apps AND the management capabilities. DT has never been intended to work in isolation.
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I support any software/tool experiments. 
I know for me, the DT inbox is helpful. That really helps me keep from fiddling with file management when I just need to save something and get on with my work. I wonder if there’s a workflow that would let you save those Word docs in Finder, but funnel them through a capture-and-classify point first. Hazel might do it.
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Day one of the experiment is partway done, and has been successful.
My plan is to continue working on existing projects in DT, and start new projects in the Finder.
My primary DT database is “2020 Misc.” I started a folder in Finder/Documents called 2020-12, for just this month. And I started a new folder in that, for a new project starting today.
I then reset Obsidian for a primary vault pointing at 2020-12. I’ll keep all kinds of documents in 2020-12 folders, and toggle between the Finder and Obsidian to access those documents – Obsidian for Markdown, Finder for everything else.
So far, this plan has proven workable the first minutes and hours of contact with actual work – a test that many organizational plans and apps fail to survive. (Many ideas and apps that seem great when you’re out walking the dog, turn out to be ABSOLUTELY TERRIBLE a few minutes after you get to your desk and try to actually use them.)
Onward!
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What is/was your use case for DevontThink?
@MitchWagner Thank you for this thread and one from last year I found in the search. I have been in great need to revamp some workflows. Downloaded and purchased DT3 this morning after reading “Take Control” book another MPU-er recommended last night along with your two threads and a few others.
For me, I have a few different “jobs”/responsibilities and trying to keep track of too many emails, too many files, etc., has become a challenge. My old work flow of saving emails as pdfs and then filing in Finder was not good. I am a legacy workplace Microsoft user so was using One Note, but really don’t like it. The ease of email archiving alone is well worth the $199 Pro price. I have to say I am nervous to be outside of iCloud synch though I have a good 3-2-1 backup system and will ultimately want the “To Go” version for iPad Pro use.
Between my recent addition of Cardhop and now DT3, I am feeling good about 2021 workflows. I really appreciate everyone sharing their perspectives on this forum. It is super helpful.
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Love this. Hook has taken on a central role for me in the organization of a current review paper I’m working on.
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@MitchWagner The thing I wonder about for your workflow is how often do you have occasion to refer back to supporting material for past projects? Is there stuff that endures, or is it all pretty much disposable/one and done? If it’s the latter, that may limit the utility of DEVONthink for you. Much like the Zettelkasten tools, DEVONthink seems to be at its best when you’re building up a corpus of reference material over time. If that’s not the case for you, maybe it’s not the right tool.
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I did a similar experiment last year. I kept just about everything in DT for the same reasons many have stated already: the syncing is far superior than any app I know, encryption, redundant and offline syncing, did I mention syncing :). But I also questioned where or not I really needed that “big” app when Finder exists.
My issue which had me running back to DT was related to searching PDFs. While I could “search” using Siri/Spotlight, and I also tried Houdahspot. I really wanted to like Houdahspot. It is well crafted software with a responsive developer but it wasn’t anywhere near as efficient getting me to the place in my PDF when searching. It could quickly tell me if what I was searching is in the PDF. In DT I could search and get to the exact place I needed over many PDFs faster than any app.
So for me, my experiment ended and I continue to work happily in DT.
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Something related, but often overlooked is DEVONsphere. It is the AI brains of DEVONthink, without the storage dumpster part. (It’s only $9.95!)
And their other product is DEVONagent, a web search aggregator and filter.
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Oh man…i thought i was done spending money. Going to give the search agent a try.
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Work flows can be very idiosyncratic. I am locked in to DEVONthink 3 now, I put notes in there and everything else. I write though and ‘compose’ you might say totally outside it then store anything I used or wrote back into it. I put notes direct into DEVONthink 3 but I hardly ever modify a note. I start a new one or pull anything back out if I want to do any work on it. Hardly ever happens: again just how I work I think?
I know it can do much more but that works perfectly for me, I find nearly everything from Houdah Spot too. It is now I always worked in a way, or mimics it. Piles and ‘sort of’ knowing where things were, my book library is the same in the physical world. I can’t give that up either after all this time. I have reduced the writing and research tools I use and find that was a good idea even though I have Houdah Spot, I couldn’t get it to work with Drafts, despite some help from the developer and dropped that as a consequence. I couldn’t put any more work into the tech so I understand how folk feel about learing curves here. I still think DEVONthink 3 worth it though and is, I would say my number one app. I would stay on Macs for that alone.
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This.
And workflows evolve. I’ve used DEVONthink since early v1 and almost do not recognize the structural rationale behind the databases I created then, compared to what I do now, putting aside the obvious difference between DEVONthink v1 and DEVONthink v3.
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I think you nailed it here. Each of my projects lasts a few days, weeks, or months. When it’s done I archive the source materials and never look at them again. DEVONThink may be overkill for me.
And that leads me to @JohnAtl’s question: DEVONThink is now central to my workflow but I’m concerned that everything I’m doing in DT is something I could be doing more easily in the Finder. And that DEVONThink adds another layer of complication, and another potential source of failure.
The latter point is the biggest concern to me. What if I come in one morning and find my DT databases have been scrambled. What then?
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Until February, I was a tech journalist – like the guys who write for 9to5Mac, ZDnet, etc., but in a different realm entirely. I wrote a half-dozen articles per week. Every article was its own, self-contained project, with source materials in a separate DT Group. Source materials consisted of typed notes, archived web pages, PDFs, Word documents, PowerPoints, audio and video files, etc.
Now I do content marketing for a tech vendor – but it’s the same process– 6-7 articles per month instead of per week, but the workflow is the same. Some people call the work I do “brand journalism.”
The nature of the work is that the source material is of little to no value once the article is done. The value has been extracted and summarized in the article itself, which is accessible on Google.
Or was accessible on Google. I find that Google is much, much worse at indexing corporate marketing material than journalism. In my old job, I found that it was easier to Google for articles for background research than to find the on my own hard disk – true even for articles I wrote myself! However, on the new job I find that Google is unreliable at finding the materials I’m looking for. I anticipate continuing to use DT as an archive of my own and colleagues’ work.
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That may be where I end up: Working outside of DEVONThink, then archiving to DEVONThink when done.
But why archive to DT? Why not just index everything?
Also: While DTTG is problematic, the DTTG databases seem like nice data repositories. An alternative to syncing the Finder to the Cloud for mobile usage (when mobile usage is an issue for me again, which at this point I anticipate in 9 months at the earliest).
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