I do a lot of “back of the napkin” math where I need to make a quick calculation using several number in various combinations. Say I need to add 12 number and divide by another number and then add another number to the result - (a + b + c)/d + e . The problem is that I’m gathering these numbers from different documents & apps before I assemble them into the right spot and calculate the result.
The calculations are “one and done” in that I don’t need to repeat the same calculation over and over, so saving them in a spreadsheet document would not make sense. However, spreadsheet applications would work if they didn’t take so long so start on my M1 Macbook and have the overhead of wanting me to format each cell.
I currently use notes to collect the numbers and spotlight for the calculation, but it isn’t efficient since spotlight disappears when I switch focus to another app.
Maybe my use case is an outlier, but if you have a similar use case, how to do you handle it? I have looked at apps like Numi and Soulver, neither of which solve my problem.
Since 1972 I’ve relied on “Reverse Polish Notation” (RPN) calculators. Starting with HP hardware, now with HP apps which emulate the hardware. I’m not sure I understand your requirements, but if you want to explore an alternative way to do calculations, check out RPN methods and apps.
Have you tried Notes for your calculations as well? Since iOS 18 and macOS 15 you can do calculations in Notes … might be easiest if you store your numbers there anyways.
Personally I use „Soulver“ for these kinds of calculations as it seems more capable and robust than Notes to me and you can easily work with variables and formulas and conversions as well.
More on the expensive side but worth it for me … but maybe give Notes a try?
I’m not sure why you can’t use Soulver for this. I wrote the formula at the bottom, and then I wrote in numbers for each variable to simulate pulling them from different documents. I even used // comments to annotate where I fake-pulled them from. This wouldn’t work for what you’re describing?
You can do it on the native calculator if you parse it properly in one line. As long as you get the syntax right you can just add numbers one by one.
That is if I understand from your words what you want the sum to do. The syntax I put below yields 106 as an answer.
There is a ridiculous ‘order of operations’ being used on a lot of calculators which they default to if you don’t use the proper or visible parsing and people have been encouraged for years now not to parse properly. Here is the right and overt parsing for what you want and it should work on most calculators. Even ones with the default Order of Operations set differently. You are using double brackets and those can get hard to track. Those simple calculations should be muscle memory after one or two attempts though
((70+95+17)/2)+15
Offhand I can’t remember but really a lot of spread sheets and so on use similar defaults for formulae. Over time it ‘hides’ what is going on though.
((70+95+17)/(2+15) is a different calculation and that is hard to see when bracketing is invisible. In fact that is how an old school pencil and paper guy like me would interpret your sum.
Calculators do have ‘default’ syntax and it being invisible leads to a lot of confusion and obfuscates the fact that one can enter one’s own syntax often in one ‘line’ as it were. I understand what you are advising and why; maybe though for simple calculations, like @majorgear wants, it would only involve typing in four brackets on a more standard Calc if it were parsed properly.
The easiest way to subvert some of this is the judicious use of brackets, e.g. if you know you want to ensure that Length x Width always provides the Area then (L x W) will always provide that result.
But this is why Soulver is so good at what it does. You can describe the components of what you’re calculating across multiple lines and then do the final calculation using those results.
That is what I was saying really and the point is that, as I said, a default is built into most programs. As you say, the defaults are dropped, ‘subverted’ as you put it, if you use proper syntax, in other words use well formed expressions. The example given is not well formed in fact.
Order of operations has been taught in schools for some years and shouldn’t be; students have to learn it even I now understand and there, in fact has been a great deal of argument about it.
It is especially misleading when mixed up with bracketed expressions as in that example. It is though, almost impossible to do with some conventions that you can’t overtly represent. The fewer the better though.
I still don’t see the advantage of Soulver, then I haven’t used it and entering brackets, doing the syntax correctly in other words, is second nature to me and has been for decades. For all I know soulver might be quicker. I can see the point if it fills in variables from other sources or you can store them and so on though. I will look at it sometime.
I disagree, it’s crucial for any kind of operation which includes Maths, otherwise how would it be be possible to reliably parse a calculation. People would put their own interpretations on it and there wouldn’t be consistency in many branches of science and computing across different nations.
But then I work in Compliance, so you’d expect me to want standardisation…
it’s crucial for any kind of operation which includes Maths, otherwise how would it be be possible to reliably parse a calculation.
Well it isn’t crucial. I won’t thread jack with this though, so this is my last word. The parsing should be there to see basically is the answer, unless you insist on putting in the extra hoop of having to remember PEDMAS and in my experience often getting it wrong anyway. If all you mean is the “brackets out” rule then we are just at cross wires, if so I apologize for the confusion. That isn’t arbitary though or ‘invisible’.
The ill formed string,
90+75+17/2+5
In fact, on my Apple calc, is accepted but parsed internally, as far as I can see, as
90+75+(17/2)+5 = 178.5
What @majorgear wants is ambiguous, soulver gives 106, as does Apple calculator, since it accepts the syntax and fills in the gaps. It should be properly parsed though as
((90+75+17)/2)+15 = 106
It could have meant though, several things including
(90+75+17)/(2+15) = 10.7
In which case you needed full parsing anyway. That is not an unusual sum either. So why not just parse properly all through? Making what you are doing clear and something you could do on a Calc in one line.
I appreciate the attraction of natural language calculators of course. I would like if some calculators didn’t ‘help’ so much and even if they carried thru, told you ‘this is ill-formed’, some spread sheets used to?
If I’m understanding, he basically wants an app like Soulver to allow table entry or Notes tables to do light formula cells. Both of those would be nice feature adds. Soulver basically gets you there with outlines of data but it doesn’t feel multi-column and you have to do a bit of labeling.
This , say I’m calculating the (list of numbers added together )/12
Let’s say I need 3 numbers from 3 different applications to add .
What I might do is
Open Application 1, note the number , say 32167
Open Spotlight, type in the number
Open Application 2 , note the number, say 123,456.60
Open Spotlight, type “+” and then type in the number
Open Application 3 , note the number, say 4.50
Open Spotlight, type “+” and then type in the number
Still in spotlight , add parentheses around the numbers
Still in spotlight , add “/12” to the end and maybe add an equals sign. Sometimes Spotlight sums/evaluates the expression automatically.
In my use case, the ideal app would take spotlight’s place, but remain visible for the enter operation , that would remove the “open spotlight” actions from the above scenario.
Not having the “calculator” disappear every time I switch applications to collect values would be ideal.
Extra point is the application takes the form of a single column spreadsheet where each value is a row and I can do an Excel-like formula like “Add rows 1 - 3 and divide the sum by 12” all in a single cell.
RPN = Reverse Polish Notation. Stack oriented evaluation for formulas. Any operator operates on the top two items on the stack. Once you get used to it using it on a calculator is so much easier. I have a HP 12C, a 15C,and a 12C emulator on y iPhone and iPad.
