Safe to upgrade to macOS 13 Ventura?


Who has been living with Ventura for a while? Is it still as jankey as all the coverage at early release suggested? Specifically the new settings app, how’s that?

My situation, I have MBP I use for video editing work. I am usually fairly cautious updating, as if my software breaks, I can’t work. My wife, however, got a new MBAm2 and I’ve updated her to macOS Ventura. I’ve had a little poke around, and it seems ok.

Again, I just want to hear from people who have been living with the OS for months already. Is it stable, has anyone had software break?


I install all the Upgrades within the first couple of days after they were released, and I had no problem with it, and never regret it!
What coverage about “jankey” you are referring to?


I don’t forsee software breaking but gosh Ventura is buggy.

3 identical displays keep losing their orientation.
Security & Privacy lose their accessibility/full screen settings every restart
Dock keeps disappearing (yes I know about the drag the mac handle to bottom of the screen).

I still recommend the upgrade

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Jankey. I’ve had to reboot this version more frequently. Accessibility/security permission often get reversed but look normal on the control panel, so they have to be toggled off an on again.


No problems. 13.2.1 now in use. Some minor old bugs related to Security and Privacy still seem unfixed but otherwise solid far as I can tell.


I use keyboard maestro a lot. Is it that these kind of programs will loose their permission to work, and I’d have to re-enable them every time I reboot?

I’m kind of leaning towards waiting a bit longer!

No. Keyboard Maestro works fine. To be honest, it’s been days/weeks since I saw the problem now on 13.2.1. Perhaps apple fixed.

The issue was in Privacy & Security where permissions to apps were somtimes “forgotten”. Easily reapplied, but a pain. But maybe resolved. Dunno.

Please do not think I am calling you out @rms! It’s just that your post conveniently highlights why I’ve been putting off updating lately when Apple tells me there is something new. Lots of little problems and annoyances have continued to be reported in the four months since macOS Ventura was released. Four months doesn’t seem like a long time, but in just another eight months we’ll start all over again with a new version of macOS. :slightly_smiling_face: Maybe I should just cast my regrets to the wind and follow @Ulli.

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I didn’t take exception to your comment. All I can say 13.x (now 13.2.1) works for me. I am able to focus on doing things instead of my computer. I get fewer “forgotten” permissions. I also upgrade soon after announcement in line with @Ulli’s approach.

Edit 25 Feb 2023. I’ve run across a probably macOS Ventura 13.2.1 (or perhaps before) issue with my Brother HL2350DW laser printer. Fails to print when there are more than a “few” (say 4/5 or more … no pattern). Searching internet suggests others notice the same issue with no advice from Brother other than to “use AirPrint” which I do. Humm. Sort of glad I have my 28-years-old HP4P still around and working fine. And, printing a PDF that fails on macOS 13.2 iMac and Macbook, can successfully print from iPhone7

Edit 27 Feb 2023. I contacted Brother Support. They acknowledged the issue and recommended I install a previous driver (link) below. Disconnect the existing printer, install the software then re-install and when adding use the “+CUPS” version of my printer (HL2350-DW CUPS). Now working fine.


If all you use for work is Word and Outlook, updating first day is fine. But my machine needs to do video editing, and all the software and plugins need to be working before I update and risk not being able to work.

So updating day one and “seems fine to me” isn’t really what I’m after!

I have currently around 200 entries in my Programs-Folder, incl. the Adobe Suites and all mayor Video and Photo Apps. I never run into a real issue with any of them, after the switch from 32bit towards 64bit, where I “lost” a few apps. But to be honest, all of them were still in use, because I just was to lazy to have a look for a replacement when this apps where abandoned, already years ago.
Apple is running a long Betaprogram, where the Devs. could adopt there Apps, if necessary, and I become informed about a new Update for the OS, not by the Note of the OS, but by a increasing number of updates in the App-Store.

There are a lot of people out there, who are warning about an early Update. But if you take a deeper look into that, most of them have no real reason for that today, other than: “I warn since 20years, what should have changed”. Most of them also have a “paying” community, and it seems that they think to be on the “safe” site with this warning.

This is a little more encouraging! Danke for taking the time to reply.

In response to your first question, I read a fair few things like this during the beta and first release of Ventura: Daring Fireball: The Fit and Finish of the All-New System Settings on MacOS 13 Ventura

Unfortunately there isn’t often coverage that indicates that stuff is working as expected now! Stuff being broken gets more clicks than “everything is fine”! Thus, as I haven’t heard anything saying “Settings is fixed and the bugs are gone” and thought I’d ask this in thread.

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Those People are sitting there the whole day, and are doing nothing else, than trying to find the kinkiest thing to blog about it, because the blogging is there whole (or a serious part) job!
And if they are not been able to find something serious, they are going to make things up, like the example you showed here.
Beside that Gruber is referring to a Russian, he should have known better, to post that thing!
That it was necessary to do so is a clear signal, that the Beta was working much better, than it was necessary for the usual blogger at that time, and he was required to make things up, to have anything to say!!
He wrote on the Aug 15th 22 that the Russian found a severe failure within Beta 5, and Gruber sounded like Dooms Day for Apple!
In reality, the Guy he refers to had released his message on twitter (link within the Headline of the Gruber Article) at Aug 10th. And he is showing his “finding” in a 9 second video, with a surprisingly bad video quality.
But if you have a closer look, you could clearly see, that this guy was not on Beta 5, he hadn’t done yet the update towards Beta 3, which was released already at July 6th, so more than a month before the both posts!!
So both are making things up, and it is pretty surprinsing, that it is necessary for Gruber, to work with tricks like that.
So, many thanks for sharing this link, as I could save my future time now if I am not reading/listening to Gruber anymore…!

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I finally got permission from IT to install macOS Ventura, so I upgraded today (to 13.2.1).

First issue I encountered: AdGuard for Safari now pops up every boot to show its main window (this did not happen on Monterey). How can I fix this?

(Second issue: MacUpdater v1 does not support Ventura, so I need to upgrade to v3 - but v1 got discontinued recently anyway?)

Apparently an issue with the App Store version of AdGuard for Safari:

I installed the GitHub build and now it seems to be fine.

I made the switch to Ventura in early January, and it’s been seamless for me. My biggest reason for not upgrading early is the suite of Adobe apps. I not only wait a few months for Apple to shake out the worst problems, but I wait until Adobe says each of the applications I use is either ready for the new OS or (more likely) the known bugs will not affect my work.

Most of my clients are not sophisticated Mac users, so I also counsel them to wait a bit so they don’t have to do any extra troubleshooting.

FWIW, I think the new System Settings is useable (unlike in the beta), but its design is still a hot mess. I can’t find a lot of things and have switched to searching for everything (inefficient, but less irritating). Also, it feels like some actions take a lot more clicking to achieve. This seems like change for change’s sake, which is not encouraging for the future of macOS.

I completely agree with this. I don’t like the scrolling interface, it seems completely right an IoS, but wrong for MacOS.

I really wonder what happened in the Systems Setting UI meeting when some said - “yup, cracked it” and everyone agreed. There are times when I really wonder what is going in in Apple’s collective head.


I really hope it was more like “well crap, we designed Ventura such that it requires the new System Settings, but we’ve run out of time to do anything but fix the worst bugs”!


Why couldn’t you find things there?
You had to guess which function would be behind which button on the old system settings, and it was hard to find things there, if you did not already know where it was.
With the new settings, you have the same chance of finding the right function by clicking on the button you think (or know) it might be the right one, but now you could simply scroll through the different areas, and get the information what is contained there right on the right side.
So finding a setting is much easier, than with the previous OS.

I do not understand the critic about the new look function wise, other than it was criticized by some bloggers (mostly because they have to find something they could blog about to get the money from showing the adds on their blogs!), and for me it seems that a lot of people are reproducing this critic now, without really questioning this.

Yes! When noted Apple haters John Gruber , David Sparks, Jason Snell, John Voorhees, Andrew Cunningham, Michael Tsai, Stephen Hackett, Howard Oakley, Josh Centers, among others, all gang up on system settings, then you know Apple must have gotten it right!

Haters gotta hate! Bloggers gotta blog!

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