Affinity 2.0 released!

Thanks for the update. I did see the forum post.

Totally understandable on the limitations to our developers. There are some non-specif apps that only implement it as an experimental feature. It’s more than a welcome toggle but I do understand if its not possible all the time. Its just difficult when the app requires me to use my left-hand with the Pencil.

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I was amazed at the forum post on Affinity complaining about the cost of the upgrade and for V2 being a PAID UPGRADE.

This was the damaged done by free apps on mobile and the perpetual free update. What we eventually got is subscription model and people complaining about paying developers for their hard work.

What can I say, people still asked me to design their logos for free.

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From a software dev perspective (no, I don’t work for Affinity!), it’s just a feature request that wasn’t completed before feature freeze for release, but is still on the roadmap.

Version 1 didn’t have it either on iPad, so it’s not a feature regression. And apparently there are issues with it on desktop (as noted on another comment on your Affinity forum post) - which leads me to believe that it’s a fair bit of work to do well, for what is likely an infrequently-used feature (in the grand scheme of things).

I have horrible eyesight, so I get your frustration and where you’re coming from. Personally, I get pretty dang excited these days when accessibility features that would help me (but that most people don’t use) are even on the stated roadmap. :slight_smile:

Use the tools that work for you, and make sure you let devs of other tools know about the issues.

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It does (in V1) on the Mac, I try very hard not to have to use the iPad for photo editing unless forced, it takes twice the time with twice the aggravation at least for me.

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My final contribution here is this quotation from a socio-linguist that if some group “hinder [people] in their daily life, professionally or privately, we can view this as a form of discrimination|”

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I think it’s important to listen to the person with lived experience of a disability telling us that this issue is preventing them from meaningfully using the software. Accessibility and inclusion are important and every industry has a long way to go to make sure their spaces, products etc are accessible for everyone.

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Yes, we believe they have the disability and took the time to do further research and make prioritization requests in support of it. A sympathy boycott of Affinity isn’t going to happen, though.

That’s true. At least in my case, I researched dyslexia and dark mode and found out about astigmatism and dark mode, and the possible interplay between dyslexia and blurred light-on-dark text from astigmatism. I made the feature request based on that.

The research seems to show that dark mode is actually helpful for dyslexics, overall, but I’m willing to believe that Glimfeather has some compounding condition that makes that not apply to them.

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What made your statement difficult overall is the hostility and the tone. I work as a UX practitioner. We try to listen to everyone’s issues because our job is to make sure that the thing we are making will be useful to everyone. I study a lot of a11y and ensure my work complied but the truth is we cannot catch 100% of issues. We need people like you to tell us if it’s working for you or not. We always reach out to different communities to ensure everyone is heard but I cannot guarantee that I will know everyone’s issue. I’m sad to say that this is also the first time I’ve heard of your issue and I feel bad as I work in UX. But it also gives us an opportunity to work harder and learn from people.

There are also time and resources to think of. Roadmaps that needed to be planned ahead. We strive to make sure that at least an app or website is usable to 90% of users but improvements are still in the pipeline. We rely on the goodness of folks to take their time and tell us what kind of issues they are facing.

Accusing people of discrimination is not the right way to solve your issues. I’m sorry to say but empathy goes both ways.

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The quote is seemingly out of context. It’s about discriminating against people primarily because of their speech accent:

However, should these attitudes towards certain accents be allowed to hinder speakers in their daily life, professionally or privately, we can view this as a form of discrimination. It creates an unequal climate as the speaker’s accent is allowed to stand in for all sorts of other character traits.

And I agree - it’s absolutely discrimination (in the negative sense of the word) if you treat people appreciably differently solely because of their accent.

I agree 100%. They’re absolutely the expert on their condition, and if we’re trying to make the software more useful to them, they’re the only person who can ultimately judge whether or not that effort is successful.

The implication, however, seemed to be that the folks at Affinity were intentionally discriminating against people with this condition. “Clear disability discrimination”. Their response on their forum didn’t indicate anything of the sort, though. They indicated that they didn’t have time to get the feature ready for the initial V2 release, but it was still on the roadmap. And as I mentioned above, V1 never had it, so it’s not a regression - but Affinity has planned a move in the more accessible direction with reference to this concern.

This.

I think it’s more than appropriate for somebody to be loud and vociferous about the fact that the app doesn’t work for them. They can explain why. Be vocal about their disappointment. The complaint that the app doesn’t have a way to respect the system settings is a pretty legit complaint, IMHO. Apparently Affinity even agrees that light mode is something that might be useful, because it’s on their roadmap.

But to me, attributing malicious intent to the devs weakens one’s case - it doesn’t strengthen it.

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In my view, I would say it’s a disability either way. The ADA defines it as, “a person who has a physical or mental impairment that substantially limits one or more major life activities, a person who has a history or record of such an impairment, or a person who is perceived by others as having such an impairment”.

That covers a lot of ground, but the mere presence of a given disability, IMHO, doesn’t inherently mean that every vendor and product needs to accommodate it.

I tend to think along those same lines. That said, the questions around disability are usually pretty basic:

  • What, specifically, is the disability?
  • Is is reasonable to accommodate this disability in a given situation?

I can think of two examples right offhand.

In the case of a fast food restaurant I used to work at that was built in the 1950s, we had a wheelchaire-bound person apply for a job - and there was no legal or practical way to accommodate them. The law didn’t require the employer to accommodate, as it just wasn’t feasible.

In the case of a friend of mine who processes things a bit slower than other people, they need extra time when taking certifications (Pearson, etc.). The testing center just requires them to produce a letter from a medical professional detailing the need, and they get extra time.

So even with situations that are covered by disability legislation, it’s usually all about the nature of the disability, and what it takes to accommodate it. I can’t imagine Affinity would be legally required to accommodate in this case, and I would bet that “light mode” being on their roadmap probably isn’t because they’re trying to make their software more accessible, but it’s cool that it’s in the works either way. :slight_smile:

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I’m not a designer; I jumped on all 3 v1 products when they were released on principle (supporting an Adobe competitor). I also occasionally use all of them for various personal products, in addition to doing any image manipulation I very rarely need to do in a professional capacity. Unfortunately, the work I do on the side of my full-time employment has slowed to a trickle that will barely cover the hosting/domain registration, so I have resigned myself to skipping this version. I hope to have the funds to purchase them at some point soon.

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All kidding aside, yes - if there’s no ability to work around it. As a personal example, I’m right-handed but left-eye dominant, which means that I shoot any shoulder- or face-anchored weapon (rifle, shotgun, bow, etc.) left-handed.

Sometimes this is a minor hassle, like me having to buy a left-handed bow. But for something like a semi-automatic rifle, that means that in the best of all possible worlds where I have to put my head is frequently directly in the path of the (HOT!) brass as it gets ejected, and for some rifles it’s directly on top of the ejection port. That means that there are some rifles that I just flat-out can’t shoot (and many more that are actively dangerous to shoot) unless I can find a company that’s modified the design for left-handed use - which is RARE, because that modification renders it non-useful by right-handed people.

The US military gets around this by installing an extra device on the rifle called a “brass deflector” that bounces the brass away from your head, which is effectively an accessibility accommodation. Some militaries just teach their troops to all shoot right-handed (which denies the problem, but is an option if you can get rid of people that it doesn’t work for). Some militaries have designed guns that can be reconfigured for left- or right-handed use, and some have designed guns that eject out the bottom and render the whole issue moot. :smiley:

Disability and accessibility are everywhere. :slight_smile:

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I’m also right-handed and left-eye dominant. The only weapon I shoot is a camera and it’s a real annoyance. When you hold the camera up to your left eye, the controls, which are basically all on the right, are difficult to access. The last camera I owned that wasn’t awkward to use was an Exa I owned back in the 1960s which was designed basically as a mirror image to every other camera I’ve owned.

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As the son of a blind (from birth) father he took exactly that attitude, he had a disability, he asked no-one to go out of their way to accommodate him or expect companies to pander to his condition, he simply got on with life, worked all his life, married raised a family and lived a full life. No whinging, or any sense of entitlement. It was just what it was, but I guess that generation is long gone.

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I absolutely sympathize. That said, people who even know they’re supposed to hold cameras up to their eyes seem to be in short supply these days. I tell my customers that complain about not being able to take good photos that I can make them a better photographer in 5 minutes - then I show them how to hold their phone/camera/whatever so that it’s stable while they shoot. :smiley:

I think with the ubiquity of technology and our increased reliance on it there are some basic, sane accommodations that everybody needs to have available (screen readers for blind people, and governments/essential agencies making their websites in such a way that the readers work, for example).

But in general, I tend to agree with you. If you can make things work without dragging other people into it, that’s optimal. That said, I think that it’s not unreasonable to make requests of the nature, “if you want me to X, I’ll need Y”. And then help the other person help you - because you’re the expert regarding what you need.

I find that the more the other person sees it as them helping you with a request rather than you making demands, the better it goes. :slight_smile:

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I’m left handed, put the camera up to my left eye, holding it in my right hand… because all cameras have the grip on the right side. :man_shrugging:

On being left handed, I have to thank my mother who, when I was a kid, suggested I try some things right handed. If I write, or throw a ball, you will know I am, but in many other activities, it won’t be obvious.

Other “disabilities” I have include “being taller than average” (see bathroom and kitchen fixtures — sure I can reach the cupboards, but I have to stoop a lot to wash the dishes, or my hands), and “not drinking coffee” (don’t start me). :laughing:

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This is true but not considered as a disability if it means being able to get a PWD card or accommodation. For example, its dangerous to be left-handed when operating old heavy machinery since most of this machines are built for right-handed. Now, safety features means both hands should be away from any mechanism like having two buttons to operate with both your hands. There are profession that are difficult but not impossible like being a calligrapher, shooting guns like what @webwalrus stated above. Some requires training your other hand or customize the tools. Either way, left-handed people adapts to be an ambidextrous on certain situation. But it would hinder a child’s braind development if you force them to use their right hand if they are left-handed.

As much as you want to accommodate all disability, it’s impossible. Generally, 75% is good, 90% is attainable. But 100% is impossible especially if you include cognitive. Some had to be customized to their needs. Some developers don’t have all the money, time and resources to do all that. This is why specialty tools and software is expensive except if they are getting an external funding to accommodate certain disability.

In our studies, there are also different level of disabilities. For example, a person who can operate you app with one hand doesn’t mean the person only have one hand. It can also mean the person is holding a baby or a grocery. Visual impairment can also mean vision loss, color blind, astigmatism, operating the app outdoor with no shade, etc.

There are levels of disabilities that product designer need to work with especially on their first iteration. They can’t cover everything in one go.

I love that the topic has evolve somehow into discussions on accessibility.

There are so many quality of life and accessibility features that was introduce on version 2. Those aren’t possible without input from actual users over the years like the modifier button and redesigned layer panel.

That was what was great about the Exa. Being basically a mirror image it was designed to shoot with the left hand (and left eye). Even right handed, I never found a problem handling the camera.

When we remodeled our house years ago we had taller counters in the kitchen and bath because we are both tall. Apparently that’s a popular mod. Of course that’s only possible if you aren’t renting.

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